Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Experiences with hard disks, SSDs, USB devices, hard disk controllers, motherboards and so.

Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby Nero » 2019.02.01. 16:10

On what basis the drive will operate for 700+ days (viability), since after repairing the unstable sectors it has returned to 1000 days again?


I tested empty space WIPE f in a tool and unfortunately in two cases failed and caused unstable sectors (and read errors). Why?


Does the HDS application not cause the appearance of further unstable sectors (near existing ones) when trying to analyze the disk or repair.
This is important to me, because an other application can completely destroy the disk while scanning the disk in search of bad sectors.
Although there may be 1 unstable sector on the disk, DiskGenius will cause more and more bad sectors to read (3000 ms). I wrote to the author many times, but never get an answer.
I know it is safe to erase entire partitions or drive without a problem, but the analysis can cause more damage.
Is HDS really safe? I do not know how HDS will behave in this situation?

How to configure HDS to immediately inform:
1. Sound signal - if there are warnings (eg bad blocks, unstable sectors)
2. Immediate display of information on the desktop or in the speech bubble in the tray

I do not want to open the application all the time and check that everything is fine with the hard drive.
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Re: Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby hdsentinel » 2019.02.05. 10:21

Can you please tell me what do you mean "bugs" and "issue"?
I see no bugs/issues at all, so wonder why you wrote that...

> On what basis the drive will operate for 700+ days (viability), since after repairing the unstable sectors it has returned to 1000 days again?

When the health of the drive improved, the problems repaired, it is completely normal and expected that the estimated remaining lifetime increases of course.


> Does the HDS application not cause the appearance of further unstable sectors (near existing ones) when trying to analyze the disk or repair.

Generally NOT the software which causes "appearance of further unstable sectors".
If the sectors are not stable (for example due to insufficient power, cable/connection issues) then it is completely normal and expected that new and new unstable sectors detected from time to time. This is independent from software: any read operation can reveal such problems - which may otherwise remain hidden, until the affected sector accessed.
So you may got new unstable sector even during copying a file, opening a document, playing music/video etc.

The read tests of any software (including Hard Disk Sentinel) helps exactly to reveal such possible issues, reveal such weak sectors and generally the problem with the storage subsystem.
This is why it is important to FIX these kind of problems first (by checking connections, replacing cables, fix power issues) - and then performing the disk repair. Otherwise yes, even if you repair problems, new and new unstable sectors will be detected from time to time. The surface test can just reveal them sooner - but it does NOT mean that a surface test function causes the unstable sectors.


> I know it is safe to erase entire partitions or drive without a problem, but the analysis can cause more damage.

If new and new problems detected, then the entire disk surface may be affected, for example recorded in unstable situation. It is very common (for example) when a 2.5" USB hard disk used with single USB 2.0 connection which does not give enough power for proper operation. Then things may work for some time - but the recorded data may not be read back.

On such drives, the best would be to perform a backup and use Disk menu -> Surface test -> Reinitialise disk surface, which would make the drive as "fresh". Further surface tests should not reveal further unstable sectors.

This is exactly described in Support -> Frequently Asked Questions -> What is a weak sector? How to repair weak sectors?
https://www.hdsentinel.com/hard_disk_case_weak_sectors.php


> Is HDS really safe? I do not know how HDS will behave in this situation?

Yes of course. It designed exactly to reveal possible problems which may remain unnoticed - until you'd really need to open a file which can't be read.


> How to configure HDS to immediately inform:
> 1. Sound signal - if there are warnings (eg bad blocks, unstable sectors)

Select Configuration -> Alerts page. Enable the option "sound alert" in the line of "When a new log entry is added".
It means you'll receive sound alert when any new problem detected and logged (in the Log page of the disk drive).
On this page, you can specify the sound alert file and set to repeat sound alert - until you acknowledge by the speaker button in the main window or right click on the tray icon.

> 2. Immediate display of information on the desktop or in the speech bubble in the tray

Select Configuration -> Alerts page (see above) and enable the "Send/display message".
On the Message settings page, you can configure what exactly to be done:
- send email
- display message
- send network message
- add to Windows event log
- run external application

Also you can configure other options, for example to make alert when the health drops below threshold, when temperature is high, shut down PC, etc..

> I do not want to open the application all the time and check that everything is fine with the hard drive.

You do not need if you configured the alerts of course, this is exactly the purpose of those options ;)
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Re: Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby Nero » 2019.02.05. 12:19

I know from experience that disk analysis may reveal an unstable sector (logical), as indicated by SMART, but any attempt to read such a sector will be associated with an increase in errors: "Raw Read Error Rate".
I learned from data recovery specialists that it is not recommended to scan the disk for defective sectors. If you do not want SMART to show more unstable sectors, do not perform any analysis under any circumstances. This can cause the unstable sectors to grow, the partition table to be corrupted, or even to completely corrupt data that can only be recovered by the company. Now I know that only erasing the partitions can only help to fix the logical without appearing further during disk analysis.
Analysis kills the disk. Why do I say that? Because I've tried to do it. And it did not work out for good.

Analysis = more unstable sectors and the end disk stops working.
Erase/wipe disk/partitions = The disk still works without problems for many years.


What is recommended when an already unstable sector appears.
Do not perform any analysis, first make a copy of the data. Then point to the disk or partition you want to wipe/erase.
example: Disk health with 93% returned to 100%
This is the only way to avoid disk failure.

Unfortunately, it's true, if I had done it before, I would not have a problem with it and now I have to send the disk to a professional data recovery company.

It should also be remembered that CHKDSK /R may hang - trying to recover a bad sector. Then it stops working. And then you have to reset the computer - and this will cause a larger disk failure. This is also not recommended.
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Re: Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby hdsentinel » 2019.02.13. 12:22

Yes, data recovery specialists usually do not recommend performing scandisk / chkdsk or similar on a failing drive, as this can usually cause more troubles by "fixing" the logical drive and preventing data recovery completely. This is why generally Hard Disk Sentinel has option to disable automatic scandisk on startup (Configuration -> Advanced options page), suggested exactly by data recovery companies.

Also yes, exactly as you wrote, on problematic drives, complete overwrite (reinitialise disk surface) is the best method to repair the drive. The page Support -> Frequently Asked Questions -> What is a weak sector, how to repair weak sectors? ( https://www.hdsentinel.com/hard_disk_case_weak_sectors.php ) describes this situation: new and new weak sectors may be found periodically (if the drive is not stable) and suggests the Disk menu -> Surface test -> Reinitialise disk surface - as this is the best way to repair the complete hard disk.

Just when only 1-2 weak sector(s) found and reported (for example due to a power failure or one accidental reset) it is enough to perform a scan and repair the problem specifically by the Disk menu -> Surface test -> Disk repair function, without the need to perform a complete backup/overwrite.

I understand your idea about performing write only on a partition, but I'm afraid this would be simply not enough in this situation, as other areas (other partitions) on the SAME drive would be also affected, damaged too. This is why there is no partition testing/erasing function is available now, as that would be simply not enough. If you prefer to completely wipe/overwrite a partition, you may simply format it (even a quick format) and copy it full with data files - and delete them (or perform quick format again).
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Re: Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby Nero » 2019.02.14. 15:41

Fast formatting does not repair logical sectors in any case. Simply the value of unstable sectors in SMART will not decrease.
It must be in-depth formatting, but a better solution is to erase the disk (zeroing) and then quickly format.
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Re: Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby hdsentinel » 2019.02.18. 10:50

Yes of course, fast formatting does not repair logical sectors in any case.
This is exactly why I wrote that you'd need to copy it full with data files to perform complete overwrite after the format.
Having a complete format in this case would only require additional time (plus would perform the surface scan you wanted to avoid).

> Simply the value of unstable sectors in SMART will not decrease.
> It must be in-depth formatting, but a better solution is to erase the disk (zeroing) and then quickly format.

This is exactly I did NOT recommend the quick format itself, but recommended to perform the OVERWRITE after the (quick) format.
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Re: Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby Nero » 2019.02.18. 17:00

hdsentinel wrote:copy it full with data files



Unfortunately, most (and even all the best tools) of the offered tools (professional) - will not make backups, because the bad sectors will be the obstacle, trying to recover data from bad sectors, it will simply hang or copy will not continue.
A person has developed a tool that solves most of the known problems with copying or backing up.
This is the only tool that will not fail in most cases, any other professional data recovery tools will always hang, etc.
As the only tool that copied the data, no problems.


- skip bad sectors [Enabled] (setting: 0 reps)
- process partially recovered

HDS - Immediately skips bad sectors without any reading?
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Re: Many question, feature, bugs, issue HDS PRO

Postby hdsentinel » 2019.02.20. 13:49

Excuse me, but we discuss about different things.
You mentioned complete wipe (overwrite) of a partition - so I recommended a way to perform a complete overwrite by copying files on the partition.
For example you can copy from other partition / disk or download files etc. to force overwriting the complete partition (maybe after a quick format).


> Unfortunately, most (and even all the best tools) of the offered tools (professional) - will not make backups,
> because the bad sectors will be the obstacle, trying to recover data from bad sectors, it will simply hang or copy will not continue.

Yes. Because they all know that cloning / copying / mirroring a disk with such unreadable bad sectors is very bad idea, restoring that will likely result in damaged / unbootable system or "just" damaged files.


> A person has developed a tool that solves most of the known problems with copying or backing up.
> This is the only tool that will not fail in most cases, any other professional data recovery tools will always hang, etc.
> As the only tool that copied the data, no problems.

Yes, such person is me - and the tool is called Hard Disk Sentinel ;)
During both in backup projects and testing/repairing the disk.


> - skip bad sectors [Enabled] (setting: 0 reps)
> - process partially recovered
> HDS - Immediately skips bad sectors without any reading?

Do you mean DURING BACKUP of files (when you configured backup projects)? Then yes, Hard Disk Sentinel skips the file and focuses on other, readable files, exactly to allow saving as much data as possible. As the backup projects designed to focus on most important data, we can ensure that the procedure will not begin (and may waste time) by mirroring temp files, recycle bin entries, system files (which could be re-installed) - just the important data configured.

Or do you mean DURING DISK TESTING? Then yes, Hard Disk Sentinel can be configured to skip problems and advance immediately, without attempting to re-read (which could take some time, but would still help to recover data). For this, please open Disk menu -> Surface test and in this window (before starting the test) select the Configuration tab. On the lower right corner, you can lower the value "Maximum try count" to prevent such retries.

The default retries used exactly as they may help to recover the unreadable, damaged data. For example, if you use Disk menu -> Surface test -> Disk repair test, then when a sector is unreadable (by default) Hard Disk Sentinel attempts to re-read and if the 2nd or further attempt is successful, it automatically re-writes the data, to repair the weak sector and stabilize - so repairing problems and make the previously damaged (unreadable) file perfect, without any, even small data corruption/data loss.
If you reduce the retry count, then the disk repair functionality will still be used (possible found weak sector will be repaired) but as then it will not able to try to get the file contents, the file may be corrupted. In some cases this may be still better than losing the complete file: for example if the file is a video file, it is better to read (and backup) with a minor glitch than losing the complete file. Or if the file is an archive, it may have recovery record (some archives support that) then the file could be repaired.

So upon such issues, a Disk Repair test is the best way to minimise possible data corruption - and by showing the affected, possible damaged files we can still decide if we want to keep them and attempt to mirror/clone (if all weak sectors fixed, as then it would be possible).
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